Show Me the Naju Fact

SHOW ME THE NAJU FACT ! #5

The Naju Investigation Committee – # 2, A veiled identity

Maria Kwon : 

Hello! Good to have you all back on our show ‘Show Me the Naju Fact’. In our last show, ‘The Naju Investigation Committee - #1, we learned about in detail, ‘Who and What were investigated?’ After the show aired, a lot of people left comments saying, ‘I was shocked!’

And there were also a lot of people saying, “I’ll look forward to ‘Episode 5’ that will let me know more about the truth clearly.” Today, the 5th episode, ‘A veiled identity, The Naju Investigation Committee – #2,’ we have here 2 panelists to discuss further. Hello, welcome to the show!

Peter Park, Sr. Michaella : 

Hello!

Maria Kwon : 

Well, through the fact check on our previous show, we learned that even the wishes of the Pope — the Church’s prime leader who supported Naju — was not reflected in the investigation. And this is such a frustrating fact. Neglecting a ‘thorough and careful investigation’, the Naju Investigation Committee was too concerned with building a pretext for rejection (of Naju). Today we are going to find out their hidden truths in detail.

Peter Park : 

Yes, in the beginning, the Investigation Committee was composed of 7 priests of Gwangju Archdiocese, who severely opposed Naju. The Church’s process to determine whether the supernatural phenomena is real or not is based on the conclusions of the Investigation Committee. So those included in the committee to investigate is really important. So after receiving some complaints to conduct an accurate and objective investigation, three more priests were added to the committee. But unfortunately, they weren’t able to investigate Naju properly, either.

Maria Kwon : 

Well, the Naju Investigation Committee was composed of priests who severely opposed Naju. (Yes.) By what kind of theological grounds and ideas did the priests of the Committee investigate Naju?

Peter Park : 

Fr. Rhee Soun Seong, the general secretary of the Naju Investigation Committee, often made remarks in discord with the Catholic doctrines about the Eucharist. Specifically, he clearly stated “I have denied the Eucharistic Miracles of Naju for the unity with Protestantism.” However, the doctrine about the Eucharist is written in the Catechism of the Catholic Church(CCC) and was spoken about by many Saints as well. But, he denied countless Eucharistic miracles which were already recognized by the Catholic Church just for the unity with Protestant. I think it holds no water and it’s absurd.

Maria Kwon : 

Yes, just now as you said that they tried to modify the doctrines of the Church, which are the official teaching of the Catholic Church, ‘for the sake of unity with Protestantism!’ I think this is a greatly dangerous idea. According to his words, Catholic doctrines should be modified for the sake of harmony with other religions like Buddhism and Hinduism.

Peter Park : 

Yes, let me elaborate. The priests who had opposing ideas to the traditional Catholic faith were selected for the Naju Investigation Committee. It doesn’t make any sense either. Fr. Rhee Soun Seong, whom we just mentioned, denied the Catholic hierarchical system. He even said that the Holy Spirit is divinely superior to Jesus. He also denied that Jesus established the Church. Because of this, he received a Written Warning from the Vatican in June, 1998 after the declaration was issued by Gwangju Archdiocese. And later, he was eventually removed from his role as a theology professor.

Sr. Michaella : 

In September 1997 and also on February 15, 1998, a newsletter of the Catholic Central Council of Korea and the Catholic newspaper stated that “Because some of the theologians had defied the orthodox faith of the Church, the Bishops’ Conference decided to take earnest action.” However, the thing is that Fr. Lee Je-min, a member of the Naju Investigation Committee, was also one of those theologians.

Maria Kwon : 

Is that true? Then that’s a big problem!

Sr. Michaella : 

That’s a very surprising fact to everyone who trusted the declaration and the results of the Investigation Committee. Fr. Lee Je-min wrote a book titled “Did Jesus really resurrect?” where he firmly asserted heterodoxy against Catholic doctrines which led him to be warned by the Vatican several times. So, on May 16, 1997, when he was working as a member of the Naju Investigation Committee, he received a written warning from ‘the Congregation for the Evangelization of Peoples’ of the Vatican. And he was banned to write in any magazine journals published by the Bishops’ Conference (CBCK). Subsequently, on January 15, 1998, he received a written warning from ‘the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith’ of the Vatican and later he was removed from his role as a theology professor after.

(Subtitles) On February 15, 1998, the Catholic newspaper stated “Because some of the Korean theologians had defied the authentic faith of the Church, the Bishops’ Conference has decided to take action.”

Bishops from all over the country will come together to collaborate their full-fledged response to the claims by some of the nation’s theologians, such as “It was not Jesus who founded the Church.” or “the Church is also a kind of society like a secular entity.” On Feb 9, the standing committee of the Bishops’ Conference, held at CCK, expressed concerns over claims made by some of the Korean theologians who defied the traditional faith of Church. They decided to discuss the issue again at the Spring General Assembly of the Bishops’ Conference. It is known that ‘the Congregation for the Evangelization of Peoples’ sent an official warning letter to those theologians’ claims through Bishop Jeong Jin-Suk, the chairman of ‘Catholic Bishop’s Conference in Korea’.

Maria Kwon : 

What an astonishing fact! The priests who asserted their views that do not comply with the Catholic faith played important roles in the Naju Investigation Committee as theology professors. I hope that you who are watching this show should also consider whether this is proper or not.

Peter Park : 

Of course it’s ridiculous. We need to know this fact that the declaration, which was written by the Investigation Committee member who received warnings from the Vatican and was removed from his role as a theology professor, is erroneous. One of the Investigation Committee members tried to topple Naju with all his false words in ‘PD’s Note’ of MBC, the public broadcast. He is Fr. Jang Yong-ju, the former leader of ‘The Catholic Priests Association for Justice (CPAJ)’

Fr. Jang Yong-ju gave a special lecture on the 90th anniversary of Daegu Mother Mary’s Chapel, entitled “Did Mother Mary become a chatterbox?” He spoke only a false testimony and his accusation against Naju throughout his lecture.

Maria Kwon : 

It’s a weird title for a special lecture “Did Mother Mary become a chatterbox?” What was the lecture “Did Mother Mary become a chatterbox?” about?

Peter Park : 

Well, here is what Fr. Jang Yong-ju said during his lecture at the time.
“I organized the Investigation Committee, and I myself, as a member of the Investigation Committee, investigated (Naju) thoroughly for three years. So, I tell you this in advance that what I’m going to say is not my personal opinion, but based on the content and results after thorough and careful investigation (on Naju) for three years.”

“Didn’t Mother Mary age in heaven and finally become senile? I heard that people didn’t get old in heaven. Otherwise she wouldn’t be so talkative like this, day in and day out.”

“And, when Jesus was 12 years old, something happened. After their visit to the Temple of Jerusalem, the mother (Mother Mary) surrounded by crowds, lost the child (Jesus) on the way back. She had been searching for him for three days and barely found him, such an immature 12 year-old boy! Ordinary parents would have slapped their child’s face in this situation. However, it’s not written in the Bible, but who knows Mother Mary might have slapped Jesus once or twice.”

“Who on earth is this Mother Mary who deprives Jesus of the Holy Eucharist Sacrament by overstepping his divine authority?”

“Nevertheless, it’s said that (in Naju) Mother Mary flippantly gave this message, that message, and all the messages day in and day out. Then if it’s said that She had been speaking messages every day and incurring strange phenomena, it’s because either She’s not Mother Mary or Mother Mary has become senile and a chatterbox. Or it’s a fabricated occurrence. The Virgin Mary we believe and venerate is a pure and innocent One, not a senile old Mother Mary like that.”

“Also, they do all kinds of things. Do you think Mother Mary or God the Father is relaying these kind of things because they have nothing to do?”

“It’s alleged that at first, the statue of Mother Mary was weeping tears, and later, tears of blood, and then, the statue also moved. So, I said ‘Wow~ She must be so bored that She dances aerobics in heaven.’”

Peter Park : 

He said, “Mother Mary has become senile and a chatterbox” or “She dances aerobics in heaven.”
This Fr. Jang Yong-ju who made these ridiculous remarks revealed that he was the very one who organized Naju Investigation Committee and said he conducted thorough investigation on Naju. But do you think that the principle of organizing the Investigation Committee was proper, and that it conducted a thorough investigations for three years? He bombarded Mother Mary with rough words, and made malicious false rumors to oppose Naju in his lecture. I think it’s because he had the misguided theological concepts deep inside him.

Maria Kwon : 

The remarks toward the Blessed Mother, ‘Isn’t She senile? She must be senile!’ How could such remarks come from a Catholic priest? It’s seriously questionable. And well, I think what he said was his own imprudence. Hearing him saying these remarks at a ceremony of the 90th anniversary of Mother Mary’s Chapel, I can infer how he would behave at informal places. How then was he like in ‘the Naju Investigation Committee’?

Sr. Michaella : 

Fr. Jang Yong-ju, a member of the Naju Investigation Committee, interviewed the interviewees with a biased intention. Here are some of them : He questioned the interviewees “Have you not heard that Julia got possessed by a shaman spirit?” (An interviewee succinctly replied,) “No, that’s not true. Those are totally baseless words.” Then the priest said, “Oh, is it? Forget about this and don’t say this to anyone.” And he asked Rufinus, “Have you ever heard about Julia telling fortune and exorcising like a shaman?”

He also asked Julia’s husband, “Has Julia ever been diagnosed with a psychiatric disorder?” The priest would even make similar remarks several times in private. (10:57) I believe the priest was trying to confuse the work that the Lord and the Blessed Mother had completed through Julia Kim by changing it into some sort of superstition or psychosis.

Maria Kwon : 

Yes, it seems that the priest had a misconception from the beginning of the investigation.

Peter Park : 

Yes, in the first declaration based on the outcome of an investigation by ‘the Naju Investigation Committee’, for various phenomena in Naju, the declaration even stated they can be said to show some preternatural power. However, there’s a very serious error found here.

Maria Kwon : 

Yes, such phrase “They can be said …” is very vague and subjective, yet was written in the 1st declaration from the Gwangju Archdiocese. It shows that they themselves revealed there was no thorough investigation done.

Sr. Michaella : 

On the contrary, in the case of Marian Apparition in Akita, Japan, after the extensive investigation by the experts, the diocesan bishop explicitly announced that the Apparition is not from preternatural power. And he even issued a pastoral letter saying, “While awaiting for the Vatican to publish the definitive judgment on this matter, I don’t ban veneration to the Holy Mother of Akita.” It was because he considered the fruit of the pilgrimages, which is important. But in the case of the Gwangju Archdiocese, despite the Vatican’s position of “Suspended Judgment” on Naju, they are still condemning the Blessed Mother of Naju. This is so contrasting (with Akita).

(Subtitle : Bishop Ito approved the Marian Apparition in Akita and accepted Our Lady of Naju also.)

Maria Kwon : 

What a difference! In the case of the Blessed Mother of Naju, Korea, the diocesan bishop simply banned pilgrimage (to Naju) in haste without any investigation, with only the excuse that they had conducted an investigation.

Sr. Michaella : 

Yes, they did. Usually for the investigation of an apparition or miracle, the committee is established with accredited experts in the fields of theology, Church law, and science for thorough investigation. For example, in the cases of Virgin Mary apparition sites such as Siracusa in Italy and Akita in Japan, both approved by the Church, the scientific investigations were conducted by a forensic medical team. By confirming with scientific testing that the tears shed from Mother Mary statues are identical to human tears, the Church recognized both apparitions.

Dr. Ricardo Castañón’s team investigated apparition sites around the world, as requested by the Vatican, to determine authenticity in sites such as Bolivia and Cochabamba. While ‘the Naju Investigation Committee’ hasn’t investigated Naju, Dr. Ricardo’s team visited Naju and conducted their own investigation.

Maria Kwon : 

Oh, I understand it means that Dr. Ricardo, who had investigated many apparition sites by the order of the Vatican, investigated Naju also. Then, some conversation might have been taken place between the team and the Vatican.

Sr. Michaella : 

Yes, there was. During the papal audience, Dr. Ricardo gave the Spanish version of the Messages from the Blessed Mother of Naju to the Pope. After the papal audience, Dr. Ricardo’s team visited Naju for investigation. Following this, he reported to the Vatican that the apparition of Naju is authentic. However, the most important thing, for the deeper investigation to confirm the authenticity of revelation, is to verify the visionary. For that, they set up an investigation team and visited Naju again in 2002.

Maria Kwon : 

Ah, he visited Naju again in 2002. He had reported that Naju is authentic to the Vatican. Furthermore, he even planned to verify the visionary. Who is Dr. Ricardo? How did he do such all these scientific verifications?

Sr. Michaella : 

Dr. Ricardo is both a brain scientist and a professor of neurophysiology. He has lectured at many universities in Italy, Germany, and Bolivia. He’s published many books and thesis about the brain, human behavior, stress, and the nervous system. He’s also an expert in the field of physiological and chemical activities of the brain in relation to human behavior. His books are also being used as coursebooks at Spanish-language universities where brain and brain activity are being studied.

(Subtitle : Ricardo Castanon Gomez
- Doctor of neurophysiology, Clinical psychology, etc.
- The Expert in 3 fields
- Delivering more than 200 lectures every year
- An internationally renowned scholar by numerous writings and scientific studies

Maria Kwon :

Wow, his work is even used as the textbooks in universities?! I think we can say that Dr. Ricardo is an authority within the field of brain sciences. Then, how can science determine the authenticity of the messengers?

Sr. Michaella : 

Dr. Ricardo has been researching visionaries who have said to see revelations around the world. He uses all of his science, medicine and psychology backgrounds for verification. He said that if the visionary is authentic, a delta wave should appear when he/she is awake. According to Dr. Ricardo, the brainwave test allows us to tell whether the message is from a supernatural origin, or from a brain disorder or mental illness, or from the devil.

Maria Kwon : 

This is such an amazing scientific method for verification! You just said, “If the visionary is authentic, we’ll see a delta wave even when he/she is awake.” What’s the delta wave and when does it usually appear?

Sr. Michaella : 

There are four different brain waves. Alpha, beta, theta and delta waves. In ordinary people, a delta wave appears in a state of ecstasy, coma, or unconsciousness. Or, it also appears in newborn babies. But if he/she is an authentic visionary, we can see a delta wave even when he/she is awake. Through this method, Dr. Ricardo’s team investigated a number of visionaries. His brainwave tests sniffed out even the false visionaries through the absence of delta waves.

Maria Kwon : 

It sounds like an astonishing scientific method for verification. However, do you happen to know if it’s possible to manipulate the delta waves?

Sr. Michaella : 

No, that isn’t possible. It is said to be impossible to generate delta waves through stimulation or manipulation.

Maria Kwon :

Oh, I see! Then what was the result of the brainwave test for Julia Kim?

Sr. Michaella : 

At first, Dr. Ricardo said “Let’s do the brainwave test when Julia receives a Message from the Lord or the Blessed Mother.” But, as she knew that Jesus and the Blessed Mother are always with her, she said “It’s okay to do the test of my brain waves right away.” So, at ‘Honam hospital’ in Gwangju, on January 7, 2002, he conducted the brainwave test together with a Korean neurologist.

Usually, when you have a brainwave test, you have to be alone in an isolated room. And since there were so many patients in the hospital at the time, doctors said, “Let us wait to look for a quiet place.” But Julia Kim said, “It’s okay to have the test anywhere.” So she had the brainwave test in chaotic and noisy situations when there were a lot of people around.

First of all, it was verified that Julia’s brain waves were completely Normal. And then the real test began. Dr. Ricardo asked her recite the words ‘joy, love, peace’. But before that, just as soon as she thought to herself, ‘Jesus! Blessed Mother! Please come to me’, 3 distinct Delta Waves appeared. So Dr. Ricardo was so astonished.

(Subtitle : Scene of the brain test of Julia in 2002)

Maria Kwon : 

Which part do you mean amazed him?

Sr. Michaella : 

It was the fact that the delta wave started to reveal right after the start, unlike the case of a visionary in Ecuador where there was no delta wave detected even in a quiet room. A delta wave started to emit only after receiving Holy Communion by the priest. But for Julia Kim, even though she was in a cluttered place, three delta waves appeared.

Maria Kwon : 

Well, while a delta wave only came out in another visionary after having received Holy Communion, three delta waves came out immediately in Julia Kim’s case when she just recalled the words ‘Jesus and the Blessed Mother’. No wonder it was an eye-opener to Dr. Ricardo! I think it is important scientific evidence for the brainwave test to verify that the Lord and the Blessed Mother are always with Julia.

(Subtitle : The reports of Julia Kim’s brain wave test appeared in the book “Reason to believe”.)

Sr. Michaella : 

Yes. Dr. Ricardo was so happy and excited with the results of the test and said, “Now no one in the world can call Julia Kim a psychotic.” And the Korean neurologist who also participated in the tests that day said, “It’s impossible to get a delta wave in a conscious person during conversation.” Therefore, we can say that the delta wave is an important implication that verifies the authenticity of the visionary.

Peter Park : 

But, the first declaration (Archbishop Yoon) stated that the miracle through Julia Kim could have occurred by preternatural power. In addition, in March 2002, during the meeting between Archbishop Choi and Julia, the Archbishop said “The Eucharistic miracle and the messages you had received could be from your hallucinations.” and he even considered Julia an insane person. But, through the brainwave test, it turned out scientifically that their claims were not true.

Archbishop Choi during his meeting with Julia : / An extract from “the 1st declaration”

Maria Kwon : 

Yes, right. I think it’s decisive and scientific proof that can refute those who accuse Julia Kim of insanity. However, besides these tests, what other scientific and medical tests have been conducted?

Peter Park : 

Well, we have the medical diagnosis on Julia Kim’s tears of blood and five stigmata. It was on Good Friday, March 25, 2005. When she shed tears of thick blood from her both eyes, many people witnessed it and gave their signatures to testify their witness. Together with the spiritual director priest and several volunteers, Julia visited the eye specialist for a diagnosis in Chonnam University Hospital, but he said “Not only were there any trace of external wound in her eyes, but they were also very clean.”

An ophthalmologist at Chonnam University Hospital -
Originally, her eyesight was normally about 0.5 but the result showed that her eyesight improved to 1.0. The doctor was astonished saying “This phenomenon can not be medically or scientifically explained.” He said it was also a mystery that she could see better than before, even while there was dried up tears of blood in her both eyes which should have blocked her eyesight instead.

Maria Kwon : 

Yes, it’s a very amazing phenomenon. As the eye specialist’s statement mentioned, “Not only were there any trace of external wound in her eyes, but they were also very clean.”, we can say that medical verification was done. Since when has Julia Kim suffered the pain of ‘five stigmata’?

Peter Park : 

Yes, it was 1982 when she began to receive ‘five stigmata’. But Julia asked Jesus not to reveal the wounds. But from time to time the stigmata would get exposed. On Feb 4, 1988, she told the priest about this. Soon after, she visibly suffered the five stigmata, and ever since she has been suffering the pain of crucifixion more frequently with exposure of the stigmata.

Maria Kwon : 

What made her five stigmata be investigated?

Peter Park : 

Around 1:00 p.m., on July 2, 1996, the stigmata appeared on both of Julia’s hands. Because of much blood loss, the spiritual director priest instructed her to go to the hospital. A neurosurgeon and a physician examined each of her hands. The neurosurgeon managed to wipe out that much blood from Julia’s hands at Namgwang General Hospital in Gwangju, and he wrote in the doctor’s statement, “It’s impossible for her to bleed so much from only this small wound, so I consider this as a supernatural phenomenon.”

Also, in a note written by a professional physician in a private clinic: “The wound forms the shape of a cross in her palm. There’s also no damage from inflammation, which is seen on wounds inflicted intentionally. In my opinion, there is no possibility that this bleeding was caused by an artificial injury.”

Maria Kwon : 

Yes. I think it’s worthy to note that the neurosurgeon already admitted clearly that was a supernatural phenomenon.

Peter Park : 

Yes, it is. Also, the doctor who had examined the stigmata was given a picture of it. This neurosurgeon who said Julia’s stigmata was a supernatural phenomenon was later diagnosed with malignant brain tumor, and he couldn’t work as a doctor anymore though he was an expert in that field. One day when he was struggling because of the severe pain in his head, the picture suddenly came to his mind that he received from Julia after the examination. Then, he put it on his head and prayed, “Please heal me with the stigmata hand of Julia.” The pain really alleviated and after a while, he was completely healed by the stigmata picture (of Julia), and he was able to work and even open his own private hospital.

Maria Kwon : 

Oh, that’s really amazing. The doctor who examined the stigmata received healing after praying with its photo placed on his head with faith. I think it’s another miraculous incident. If ‘the Investigation Committee’ had been willing to investigate medically/scientifically miraculous phenomena in Naju, they could have done so. Were there any other scientific and medical tests conducted for other phenomena in Naju?

Sr. Michaella : 

Yes, there was a DNA test done for the Precious Blood. In 2002, Dr. Ricardo’s team came back to Naju for a brainwave test after the parish priest urged Julia to confess a lie : “All the miraculous phenomena in Naju are fabricated.” As Julia Kim had refused to do so (confess a lie), she was rejected by her parish church.

Fr. Anthony, an elderly priest at that time, said to her, “Read and meditate the Liturgy of the Word at home together with Rufinus, the chairman of ‘Station’ instead of attending Mass in the parish church.” So she was doing it everyday with her family. On January 6, 2002, Dr. Ricardo’s team joined Julia during the Liturgy of the Word in her home.

One of the team members was an Australian lawyer, named Ron Tesoriero. Since 1992, he has examined supernatural phenomena in the Catholic Church. He produced a documentary on Dr. Ricardo’s research results, named ‘Signs from God, Science Tests Faith’, which was aired on FOX TV in the U.S. And in his book ‘Reason to Believe,’ he wrote about the brainwave test of Julia.

- Since 1992, he has examined supernatural phenomena in the Catholic Church.
- He produced a documentary on Dr. Ricardo’s research results.
- His documentary named ‘Signs from God: Science Tests Faith’, was aired on FOX TV as prime-time television show in the U.S.
- The program was aired throughout the world in 1999.
- He continued to research and work with Dr. Ricardo.
He visited Naju together with Dr. Ricardo, and videotaped every process of that entire happening in Naju. And during the Liturgy of the Word, a miracle that two Eucharists descended occurred. Dr. Ricardo was the first who witnessed the miracle when the Eucharists were descending from above.

Maria Kwon : 

Wow, he attended the Liturgy of the Word and became the first witness of the miraculous happening before his eyes.

Peter Park : 

Yes, he was. At the time, lawyer Ron Tesoriero also kept his eyes on everything that occurred in Naju and he even videotaped it. So it was impossible that this is fabricated. But, Fr. Jang Yong-ju, a member of the Investigation Committee, later said, “Whenever an important person like the Apostolic Nuncio visits, so-called Eucharistic miracle occurs.” He also said, “Someone threw the Eucharist from behind.” How can they say that it was fabricated even though Ron Tesoriero and the investigation team were videotaping everything?

Dr. Ricardo introduced the Eucharistic miracle of Naju.

Sr. Michaella : 

Yes, what’s even more astonishing was that, from the Eucharist that descended when Dr. Ricardo was in Naju, 3 drops of the Precious Blood flowed out on Nov 24, 2002. For your reference, in Venezuela, when a single miracle of the Precious Blood that flowed out from the Eucharist occurred, it was officially recognized after some scientific verification that it’s human blood. However in Naju, there were 3 miracles of the Precious Blood flowing from the Eucharists. One of the three was sent for a DNA test and it yielded result.

(Subtitle : Investigation on the Apparition in Betania,Venezuela)
-A single Eucharistic Miracle occurred.
-Scientific Investigation on the Eucharistic Miracle
-After verification of human’s blood on the Eucharist, the apparition was recognized by Church.

Maria Kwon : 

Oh, then since there is a DNA test result of the Precious Blood from the Eucharist, we can say it’s a real scientific verification to check the fact!

Sr. Michaella : 

‘Yes. Not only the Precious Blood, but also other miracles of Precious Blood that occurred in Naju were examined scientifically. A test was conducted at the DNA test center in Seoul collaborating with the National Police Agency on Nov 1, 2006. With authorization granted by a priest, the DNA test was conducted eight samples of the Precious Blood.

Maria Kwon : 

What were those eight samples that you mentioned?

Sr. Michaella : 

Samples were collected on all different dates from February 28, 2001, to October 19, 2006. Those samples were from the miracles of the Eucharist and the Precious Blood on different dates and at different spots. The DNA tests revealed that all eight samples originate from one identical male human with blood type AB. The result also matches the blood type of the Eucharistic miracle in Lanciano church in Italy, in the 8th century.

Maria Kwon : 

Well, that’s a very amazing fact. Those samples were all from the miraculous Eucharist and Precious Blood on different dates and at different places. The DNA tests revealed that all eight samples had exact same DNA profile. The findings proved that the blood type is identical to the miraculous Eucharist in Lanciano. We can say this is a tremendously important result of scientific verification.

Peter Park : 

Right. Something even more amazing occurred on July 1, 1995, when about 1,000 people gathered at the Blessed Mother’s House for the vigil. Of course, I was also there at the time. When the Seven Eucharists descended on July 1, 1995, the priests of the Investigation Committee didn’t consider Them as Eucharists. They gave the order through the parish priest (to Julia), “Eat It up!”

Hearing the order, Julia Kim, in the heart of obedience but in tears, on July 2, together with Fr. Su and Fr. Marcial and four faithfuls, received each of the 7 Eucharists. Julia was crying for she couldn’t preserve the miraculous Eucharists in order to obey the priests’ instruction. And the Eucharist she received turned into the Flesh and Blood, which became fully swollen up in her mouth and some of It was swallowed while she was sobbing.

Fr. Su dipped his fingertip on the rest of the Eucharistic Blood left in her mouth, and showed It to everyone who then witnessed the Flesh and the Precious Blood at the spot. He stained the blood in a handkerchief. And Fr. Su confirmed that there was no physical wounds in her mouth. At that place, there was a non-Catholic woman holding a baby - with an oxygen respirator - in her arms. When Fr. Su prayed with the Precious Blood on the baby’s forehead, a miracle occurred: The pale dying baby was healed. Seeing the miracle, later, the family members became Catholics.

The DNA sample of the Eucharistic Miracle on July 2, 1995 was examined at the same Lab on Nov 8, 2006. The sample was also proved to be AB blood type of the identical male as in the previous 8 samples. The chief researcher who conducted the test said, “You will always get the same result even if it was conducted in any other laboratory in the world.”

Subtitle : The chief researcher for DNA test
Subtitle : 8 samples / the Precious Blood sample (July 2, 1995)

Maria Kwon : 

Yes, it was proven the same identical result of the Blood sample of 1995 and 2006. It’s amazing that all these samples, with so much time in between, originate from one identical human. As the test was done at the DNA center collaborating with the National Police Agency, so we can say that this is genuine scientific data! However, can a DNA result happen to accidentally match or be similar with others?

Sr. Michaella : 

No, the probability is less than one over 10 billion, IMPOSSIBLE! Human DNA has STR genes that appear in a series of Nucleic acid sequence, so if you do a DNA of the semen, blood, hair, etc. you are able to analyse whether it is from the same person. So if you randomly examine two different samples, the probability that any two people could have exact same DNA profile(API) is less than one percent out of 10 billion! Surprisingly, the blood samples from Naju were all 100 % proven identical.

Maria Kwon : 

So, as you just mentioned, all the samples showed an identical result, which proves that they’re from the same identical person, so it became the scientific evidence, right? For those of you who are watching this show, we are telling you the facts proven by scientific data and evidence that the Investigation Committee hasn’t even attempted.

Peter Park : 

Some doubted the Eucharist turned into the Flesh and Blood in Julia’s mouth. Some said, “Isn’t that Julia’s blood? Did she bite her tongue?” But at the time, the priest confirmed that there was no wound detected in her mouth, and DNA tests showed that the blood was from a man with blood type AB. The research team that conducted the test became more and more astonished finding every fact that the Blood DNA from the Eucharist in 1995 and the Blood DNA from 2001 to 2006 were from the Same Identical Man.

Maria Kwon : 

I’m sure those who are watching this show are also amazed. Then, could we also know the blood types of Julia and Julio Kim by any chance?

Peter Park : 

Sure. Julia Kim’s blood type is O, and Julio Kim’s is type A.

Maria Kwon : 

Oh, then we can be firmed saying that the Precious Blood was not from Julia or Julio Kim. If anyone of you were suspicious about the Eucharistic miracle, with the thought that Julia had bit her tongue and her blood came out, we remind you now that the blood type of Jesus is a male type AB, and Julia’s is a female type O. 34:33 These are completely different.

Subtitle : we remind you now that the blood type of Jesus is a male type AB, and Julia’s is a female type O.

Sr. Michaella :

Yes, there’s something even more certainly amazing. It was November 9, 2001, when the Precious Blood first came down on the way of the Cross at the Blessed Mother’s Mountain. More than 3,000 stones and fallen leaves were stained with the Precious Blood. It was also on that same day when the Cardinal in Monterey, Mexico, invited Julia to an International Marian Conference of our Lady of Guadalupe.

Maria Kwon : 

You mean the international event which we talked about in the episode #3, ‘Obedience’? The Conference that Cardinal of Monterey invited her to attend, correct?

Sr. Michaella : 

Yes, that was a great opportunity to make the Blessed Mother of Naju known to the world. Nevertheless, Julia Kim had to decline it in obedience to the Gwangju Archdiocesan Bishop. So, on this day, she was praying the Stations of the Cross to participate in the Passion of Jesus. At that time, at the 6th Station, Julia Kim saw a vision.

Jesus was walking barefoot along the path of the Stations bleeding. Mother Mary was accompanying Him in Tears. And at the 12th Station, She began to weep Tears of Blood. At the 15th Station, Julia Kim saw Jesus entering into ‘the Statue of the Resurrected Jesus’, and Mother Mary into ‘Her Statue at the fountain of the Miraculous Water’

Peter Park : 

Yes, it was November 9, 2001. At the 10th Station, Julia received a Message from the Blessed Mother who was weeping Tears of Blood. At that moment, a volunteer shouted “Blood!” When she looked astonishingly, thousands of stones and fallen leaves on the path of the Stations were stained with the fresh Blood, just as she saw in her vision. And, from the 12th Station, the Bloodstains formed in two lines just like two people were walking. That’s why the Stations of the Cross in Naju is called “the Stations of the Cross where the Lord and the Blessed Mother accompany us, shedding Blood.”

Maria Kwon : 

Oh, I see. While I think she might have been sorry about not being able to attend the International Conference, I think that Jesus and the Blessed Mother gave her a bigger gift that day with this amazing sign that occurred on the Way of the Cross.

Peter Park : 

Yes, I agree. In fact, in May 2001, the 2nd declaration was issued along with tremendous rumors. Before that, Julia slept only three hours a day. And after the declaration, she made up her mind to even offer up her 3 hours sleeping time and began doing the Stations of the Cross everyday without any sleep from July 5 of that year, for the sanctification of the clergy and the repentance of sinners, offering up her extreme pains. And then on the 128th day of her offerings, which was Nov 9, 2001, Jesus sent down the Precious Blood for the first time on the Way of the Cross. That’s when Jesus and the Blessed Mother told us through the Messages that They are always accompanying us.

Sr. Michaella : 

After that, on September 8, 2003, the feast of the Nativity of the Blessed Virgin Mary, DNA test for the Precious Blood that came down on the Blessed Mother’s Mountain was done according to the instruction of the spiritual director : First, the researchers requested 10 samples of stones stained with the Precious Blood for a test at the laboratory. Then, the 10 stones stained with the Precious Blood which descended on Nov 9, 2001, on Jan 11, 2002, and on Aug 15, 2002 were sent for the DNA test.

Prof. Lee Jeong-bin, a doctor of medicine at Seoul National Univ., was the one who conducted the test. He is the highest authority in forensic medicine in Korea. The prof. Lee’s team examined the 10 samples stained with the Precious Blood from the Blessed Mother’s Mountain in Naju. Each sample was examined at least five times, totaling for more than 50 iterations.

Maria Kwon : 

50 repetitive examinations! I think it’s a trustworthy and fully thorough scientific test that is very precise.

Sr. Michaella : 

Yes, it is. The result showed that the eight samples of Blood, except two, were from a male, and bore an identical DNA structure result after several repetitive examinations. The blood type of those samples was AB.

Subtitle : <DNA Test Result after 50 iteration with 10 samples>
8 Samples of Identical DNA structure / Blood type AB(Male) - Jesus

Maria Kwon : 

Then how were the test results for the other two samples?

Sr. Michaella : 

The blood of the other two samples turned out to be from a female. And both samples had an identical DNA structure and blood type BO. And a while ago, we talked about the DNA test conducted in 2006. This test sample was from the Precious Blood of the Eucharistic miracle on July 2, 1995. Before that, prof. Lee Jeong-bin also conducted the DNA test of this same sample (in 2003).

Here comes an astonishing result! Professor Lee said that the DNA structure of the Blood from the Eucharistic Miracle on July 2, 1995 matches that of the 8 Blood Samples. In other words, the Blood on the test samples from the Eucharistic miracle taken on July 2, 1995, and the Precious Blood samples from November 9, 2001, January 2002, and August 15, 2002 all turned out to be from the same male Blood

Maria Kwon : 

Wow! That’s really awesome. Different spots, and different times with a great time gap in-between the years 1995 and 2002. The Precious Blood of the Eucharistic miracle that occurred in Julia’s mouth, and the Precious Blood found on the Way of the Cross all disclosed an identical DNA profile. I think there has never been such a miracle in the world.

Peter Park : 

That’s why it’s called ‘the unprecedented miracles’. And also, it is true that the female blood type found in the two samples is consistent with the Message given by the Blessed Mother on Nov 9, 2001. The Message is as follows:

“Remembering that I listen attentively to the sounds of fervent prayers which you offer up at the Stations of the Cross on Calvary, and that I accompany you, shedding tears of blood alongside my Son Jesus Who is shedding blood and is with you. Become more awake and live a consecrated life for the conversion of sinners and the sanctification of the clergy.” Therefore, the woman’s Blood that prof. Lee analyzed must be the Tears of Blood shed by the Blessed Mother, Who accompanies Jesus carrying a heavy Cross for our salvation, shedding Blood.

Maria Kwon : 

Yes, the Blessed Mother said in her message that She’s accompanying Jesus on the way of the Cross. And it reminds us of the movie where Mother Mary walked the Way of the Cross, accompanying Her Son Jesus. By that, we can conclude that the blood test result of a type B female was from the Blessed Mother!

Peter Park : 

Yes, let’s take a look back into our Church history. The Virgin Mary has given Messages and Signs in many places in the world to support the Lord’s salvation work for the sake of mankind. But nowhere else in the world except Naju, has such phenomena occurred with so many miraculous signs and synthesis of all Marian Messages in a strong way. This is unheard before.

Jesus holds the keys to death, hell and heaven. To accomplish the work that Jesus began, He gave us Messages and Miraculous Signs in Naju, which are significantly important. Also, to complete His salvation work for the sake of mankind, He has chosen Naju, Korea as His youngest child, Julia Kim as His little soul, and Naju Shrine as the Holy City of God.

Sr. Michaella : 

Yes, it is. One of the reporters who visited Naju wondered, ‘Why didn’t they investigate Naju even though the reports of those scientific proofs for the miracles are available?’ And then he said, “Ah! They must have intended to deny Naju from the beginning. So if they truly did investigate it, they would have no other choice but to officially recognize Naju. That’s why they chose not to investigate it at all.”

Maria Kwon : 

I see. I think it was an investigation with a negative cause to deny it (Naju) from the very beginning. That seems what the reporter felt also. As we continue to check the facts, it’s clearly being revealed that the 1st declaration was issued without proper investigation. The ‘3 years of careful and thorough investigation’ issued by Gwangju Archdiocese never included the investigation documents referring to the scientific test results to be publicized in an objective manner.

Peter Park : 

Right. Look at the world now. Now the world is more evil, gravely offending God, than during the times of ‘Sodom and Gomorrah’ or ‘Deluge of Noah’. God the Father said, “This world has turned into a state of extreme disorder.” and the cup of God’s wrath has become inevitable. However, in such a world, the Blessed Mother came to save us. The Core of the Messages of Naju is “A Life of Repentance” and “Practicing the Five Spiritualities of Naju” - the Last Weapon for Salvation, through which we live the life of a humble and little soul.

Maria Kwon : 

Yes, it is. Today, we’ve learned lots of facts from “The Naju Investigation Committee #2, A Veiled Identity” Through the show today, we’ve checked the fact that the Naju Investigation Committee, neglecting a thorough investigation, did not consider any of the scientific findings recognized by the Vatican or authentic forensic data as a basis for the investigation’s conclusions. Many of you must be shocked now.

As there are scientific and medical data available for conducting a fair and transparent investigation, it is the DUTY of the Investigation committee of the Church to make active steps forward to reveal the Correct Facts through a Genuine Investigation.

I appreciate both of you for your hard work today. Next time, we will be back to you with another subject; ‘Suspicion from Malicious Rumors’. ‘Subscribe’

Peter Park : ‘Like’

Sr. Michaella : ‘Comment’

Maria Kwon : Please don’t forget it! See you next time, bye!